Green Coats

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Adam Hayes
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Green Coats

Post by Adam Hayes » Wed Feb 04, 2009 7:04 pm

Between 1688 and 1700 did any state / regiments (apart from the Russians) wear green coats?
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Post by barr7430 » Wed Feb 04, 2009 7:22 pm

Yes...

Danish regiment Fynske, Fyn or Funen
Swiss in French service Schellemberg
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Post by Ronan the Librarian » Wed Feb 04, 2009 11:33 pm

According to Charles Grant's two-volume work "Armies and Uniforms of Marlborough's Wars", in Austrian service there were the seven regiments of Walloons, the Alt Heister-Nigrelli and the Lorraine infantry regiments, and the Schlick dragoon regiment. Elsewhere, the Leibregiment of Osnabruck; the Boufflers, Firmacon and D'Asfeld dragoons of France; the Genovois dragoons of Savoy; at least one horse and seven dragoon regiments, and one infantry tercio in the Phillipian Spanish army; and at least one infantry tercio in the Portuguese army.

It was a notoriously difficult colour to produce at that time, not only because it involved dyeing the fabric twice (blue, then yellow), but also because it was a difficult colour to "fix" - often fading to a very dark, or very light colour depending on whether the blue or yellow dye had predominated. (Even in the Napoleonic period, Russian uniforms could vary from black to a bronzish, yellowy-green - the latter was often called "philamott green" in the British Army, from the French "feuilles mortes" - dead leaves.) It is important to note that there were similar problems with green paints, and it is quite common for this colour to turn dark blue in paintings of this period, so it is quite possible that a number of uniform paintings have been misinterpreted over the years.

One of the moderators of the WD3 forum ("Gungnir") lives in a part of the Low Countries where a lot of green cloth was manufactured in this period (possibly explaining its use by Walloon regiments). A great deal of green cloth was bought from this region by Russian merchants and apparently, one of their little tricks was to use the difficulty in balancing the process to get a better price. They would order large amounts of green cloth in advance, and then when they were shown samples, they would refuse to buy it because the colour was "not right". They would then send in an anonymous agent to "take it off the manufacturer's hands", and when they got it back home, sell it on to the relevant authorities in Russia at the full price.
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Post by barr7430 » Thu Feb 05, 2009 12:20 am

Iain,

sources were from the top of my head:
1. Fynske : two plates I've seen.. the first is actually I think in the Osprey Boyne book. I'll try and remember the second.
2. Schllemberg... Mark Allen's WI series on the Wars of the Grand Alliance. Issue 56 I think... Foreign troops in French service.

As I am not a primary reaearch source for this rahter esoteric info you may be able to correct them... I'm the messenger :wink:
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Post by Heneborn » Thu Feb 05, 2009 6:29 am

Good info there Ronan! Thanks!

In Sweden the Bohusläns dragoons had green coats with yellow cuffs from 1689 and onwards. At least in 1675 the finnish regiment Savolax had green coats with white cuffs but in 1683 they had blue coats with red cuffs. Later during the GNW (1718 - 1720) Åbo läns and Nylands regimnts had green coats with red cuffs, both were finnish regiments and a bit outside the asked time...but anyway :wink:
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Post by barr7430 » Thu Feb 05, 2009 8:55 am

Iain,

checked that other source late last night. An old Blandford military uniforms of the world book from the 1960s. Shows the Fynske Regiment in 1678 with Green coats and yellow cuffs.. Skane Wars era.
I have seen several references to the Green coats in Ireland including several wargames units belonging to others over the years with the same colours. A Battle of the Boyne game by the Teesside lads in the early 1990's had them in green too.
Am aware of the steel grey faced green references..

Have you dismissed all others as inaccurate? What source are you citing?

cheers

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Post by Heneborn » Thu Feb 05, 2009 10:07 am

Dan Schorr also says that the Fynske regiment (both 1 and 2) had green coats with yellow cuffs and lining (already in 1675) in his "Danish Army 1675 - 79"
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Green Coats

Post by Saxon Warrior » Thu Feb 05, 2009 3:01 pm

I'm not willing to argue or disagree with those who know more about the period than me, (i.e. evryone else), but I recall reading that it was the Danish Prince George regiment that had green coats. At least until 1701, (I think), when everyone went grey.
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Post by Adam Hayes » Thu Feb 05, 2009 6:43 pm

Thanks all. Schellenburg was the one I had in the back of my mind. I was a bit dubious about Fynske having only seen it in the Osprey and white cuffs being very impractical :) If there is an alternative uniform with grey coats and green cuffs could it be the drummer/officer or vice versa?
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Post by barr7430 » Thu Feb 05, 2009 8:54 pm

Don't be so hasty about the white cuffs Adam :wink:
It was the most common British facing colour for a long time in this period:
Dumbarton's (1st) being just one of the units with that colour
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Post by Churchill » Mon Feb 09, 2009 1:12 pm

Ray.
Last edited by Churchill on Sun Mar 02, 2014 11:08 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by barr7430 » Mon Feb 09, 2009 9:51 pm

Iain,

do you have the Mark Allen article? His work was extensive(although by his own admission sometimes inaccurate) and generally very good. He is a serious student of this period and in all published over 20 detailed and personally illustratede articles drawn from original sources.

I will find it again and give the details.. I am not his brother, cousin, father or priest incidentally :wink:
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Post by Adam Hayes » Mon Feb 09, 2009 10:18 pm

Churchill wrote:Hi all,

Another Regiment with white cuffs, Fergusson's 26th Foot (The Cameronians) 1704.

Image

Any excuse to show my figures off :lol:

Kind Regards...........Ray.

Image
See they're already looking grubby around the edges :D
(Nice work.)
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Post by barr7430 » Mon Feb 09, 2009 10:44 pm

you've really started something with this green uniforms thing Adam... Iain and I are scrabbling around like a couple of Oxford Dons trying to find the definitive source material.... you BOUNDER!! :wink:
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Post by martin terroni » Tue Feb 10, 2009 6:59 am

Nice figures Churchill, I never thought a colour could cause so much trouble though :shock:

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