League Of Augsburg - Fighting Talk

Hi all!
Does anyone have any idea what flag the Hartischer cavalry unit used in the WSS?

Any help would be gratefully received!

had a quick look at condray.no mention of the hartsciere flag at all. apart from he thinks it may have been lost a munich after blenhiem.sorry can't be any more help.

The Hartschier-Leibgarde is to be found here:

http://www.kronoskaf.com/syw/index.php? ... Hartschier

but it seems it had no flag or Standard until 1747

it seem's strange that all the Bavarian guard units had standards but the hartischer doesn't.

"Hartischer" is "twisted english"

correct is HARTSCHIER

The Hartschiere did indeed carry a standard. Karl Staudinger (Geschichte des kurbayerischen Heeres, Vol. 1 pg.148 footnote 3) indicates that when formed in 1669, the Hartschiere inherited the standard of the old “Korbiner”. He states that little is known of its appearance, but he speculates that, “…on one side of the silver brocade cloth was the Madonna, since Maxillian I, “the Patrona Bavariae”, in a red silk dress with a white lined blue cloak, with a gold crown on her head and the septer in her hand. On the other side the Arms of Kurbayern – all in rich silver embroidery.”

In Vol.II-1, page 17, Staudinger indicates that the standard was carried through 1728 when a new one was issued,

On the other hand, August Kühn is his booket, “The Army of Max Emanuel, Elector of Bavaria” describes and illustrates an entirely different standard for the Hartschiere in 1701. “A standard of yellow damask with golden fringes and rich golden ornamentation. On the obverse a curcifix with Jesus and in the four corners EME with Electoral cap. On the reverse the Bavarian arms with the order of the Golden Fleece under the Holy Ghost.” Unfortunately, as is usual with Kühn, his source is unknown.

Staudinger, Vol II-1, pg 17 footnote 6, indicates that in 1702 two colours were issued to the Harschiere, but that these were kettledrum colours. Perhaps, Kühn confused these for a new standard.

I hope this is helpful.

danschorr wrote:On the other hand, August Kühn is his booket, “The Army of Max Emanuel, Elector of Bavaria” describes and illustrates an entirely different standard for the Hartschiere in 1701. “A standard of yellow damask with golden fringes and rich golden ornamentation. On the obverse a curcifix with Jesus and in the four corners EME with Electoral cap. On the reverse the Bavarian arms with the order of the Golden Fleece under the Holy Ghost.” Unfortunately, as is usual with Kühn, his source is unknown.

Staudinger, Vol II-1, pg 17 footnote 6, indicates that in 1702 two colours were issued to the Harschiere, but that these were kettledrum colours. Perhaps, Kühn confused these for a new standard.

Based on the undated Hoffman plate of the "Hartischer" (his spelling) kettledrummer, these drum banners were blue and bore the ducal crown with the "lion and lozenge" Bayern arms underneath and the Golden Fleece behind them, the whole surrounded by a gold chain with some sort of medal or order hanging from the bottom of it. Whilst, at first sight, this might appear to be much too different from the flag with a yellow field for Kuhn to confuse the two, the banners do look similar to the field and devices on the other Lifeguard squadron flags.