Jacobite?? Or not!

[barr7430]

Actually, I'm surprised Marlborough hasn;t crept in yet... whoops...

you leave the door open for a second and there he is!

[j1mwallace]

Do I detect a certain bias there mr Hilton?

[obriendavid]

Do I detect a certain bias there mr Hilton?

He never goes far without his wooden spoon!
Cheers
Dave

[j1mwallace]

How can he be biased against the greatest British general of all time?!

[barr7430]

Now, if I reply to this piece of BAIT then I will be accused of hijacking the entire thread and Marlboro appears yet again somewhere he shouldn't!
Suffice it to say that he does have a connection on the thread because he couldn't make up his mind whether he was a Jacobite or not...

First he sucked up to James for patronage and advancement..

Then they were both nobbing the same birds....

Then he got greedy and thought he'd lose everything and so dumped his mate to hang about with someone foreign bloke who he thought was cooler and could lend him more stuff.....

Then he went on a few days out with his new pal who thought he wasn't 'into it ' enough and showing the right level of enthusiasm. That resulted in him not been asked to parties and drinking and wars and stuff..

Then he threw a moody and took his baw home for a while....

Then, when he thought he was going to get thrown out of the gang he started writing to his old mucker and saying "You were always my bestest pal anyway Jimmy.. can we play together if you get famous again...

Then he got another chance to come out of the naughty corner and be cool in front of Jimmy's youngest daughter.. doing sweet jumps and shit on his skateboard...


Then he won the odd rumble or two with a lot of help from his big Italian mate with the funny hair do and odd coloured clothes (style, something that will reach Britiain in about the year 2222)....

Then he marched up and down, up and down got less good at what he was doing and a a bit fatter ending up looking like a Tory cabinet Minister...

And then... he got dropped for being Freddie Wedlock (The Oldest Swinger in Town)...

The End...

Jacobite or not? You tell me...

As for the other question..... The Greatest British General....

I always thought that was General Sir Anthony Cecil Hogmanay Melchett, Knight Commander of the Order of the Bath

[markdo]

Thank goodness you didn't rise to the bait, Barry....

[Friedrich August I.]

The Greatest British General....

I always thought that was General Sir Anthony Cecil Hogmanay Melchett, Knight Commander of the Order of the Bath

Wasn't that William George Keith Elphinstone?
Novelist George Macdonald Fraser aptly called Elphinstone “the greatest military idiot, of our own or any day.”

[Forlorn Hope]

If anyone knows Mr Tamson could they PM him with a message that the CSA are looking to have word with him about certain parenting and financial issues

Regards

[Ben Waterhouse]

Actually, I'm surprised Marlborough hasn;t crept in yet... whoops...

you leave the door open for a second and there he is!

If I can refer the Honourable Gentleman to my post on page 3...

[Russian James]

Barry, 'Pretender'????


Disappointed in you Sirrah...

[barr7430]

I was playing to the the gallery somewhat there James

I thought my 'Boyz inthe Hood' description of HomeBoy JC was reasonably balanced markdo

I mean, he was what we in Scotland call a F*****' Chancer!

All power to him too and of course his biographers have done a fantastic job in polishing up his image over the centuries to put him on a plinth beside Mother Theresa, Gandhi, Nelson Mandela and other Holy Spirits

I know, I know, I'm off again...

But never forget, he betrayed his best mate, slept around, changed sides and was a generally greedy little scroat.... no matter what the Choir sing... he did all that stuff and we know it!

[j1mwallace]

For a straightforward unbiased view of Saint john Churchhill's life you can do no better than read his biography written by Winnie in the 1930's. I'm "reading" it at the moment, and heavy going it is. Nearly getting to the interesting stuff after 450plus pages.
Never use one word when you can use 10, Winston.
The only book I've ever read that was more long winded was Joshua Lawrence Chamberlain who was obviously a professor of rhetoric.
His book could have been shortened to a pamphlet.

and just to "haud the cats arse to the sun" (scottish proverbs.)
Pretender .... absolutely!!

[barr7430]

God Jim, you REALLY know how to live on the edge. I can just see you there on the manor in Dumfries, port in one hand, cigar in the other Winnie resting on your lap( ), leather arm chair, smoking jacket and cravat, gazing through the blue smoke at your Highland cattle grazing in the meadow.....

Here is me, sitting in my wee flat on the 19th floor at JBR up to my arse in budget spreadsheets(which are getting in my way as I'm trying to do the orbats for next weekend! )

I'll just have to go and calm down and dream about how King James would have made it better for all of us if only he'd pushed the army down the hill at Donore!

Now, where was JC that day when he was needed by his old mucker Jimmy Stuart?... oh that's right.... brown nosing a Dutchman!

[Rebel]

Barry,

it was obviously Chas II who shared CHurchill's female interests...

Babs Villiers if I recall - If it has have been James, then it would have been Duke of Alabama not Albany (apols to Alabamians).....

I Too have Winnie's tome, and to be honest I gave up - It will come in useful for ref purposes....maybe....

But as John Callow in his 2 vols on James says (as does Mr Hilton) much of it was polishing of the ego/reputation...That said you can't go wrong with the late Richard Holmes.....

[barr7430]

Yes Mike indeed the brother, I was just getting too carried away in my chain gun volley that I forgot which Stuart he was swapping with, I would be prepared to bet however that as it was a gaggle of mad shaggers in the post Restoration upper classes that they probably swapped shifts too ... Jimmy and Johnny.

I had the privilege of attending an after dinner speech at the Athenaeum in London given by the late R. Holmes. His talk was'Marlborough'. I think Holmes, although he admired the man was under no illusions about his modus operandi. He was not shy in describing him as an opportunist, of questionable trustworthiness and to an extent a bit of an egomaniac. In fairness though he did reckon him to be Britain's finest ever general.

This thread will of course run and run.. and I don't want to divert it off topic as I think it has enough legs to rival that old donkey the Blenheim OOB thread.. but, I think that the compared with the achievements of Wellington the title is a bit generous. I would also give consideration to a man who I think history has been very unkind too particularly because in the age of photography, sound recording and living memory.. he appears to have been a cold, unlikeable fish.... Montgomery. I like the under dog, always have. Montgomery achieved a lot but is given a very uncharitable press. Maybe if we'd all had the privilege of meeting Wellington or Marlbro... we might have also thought their characters unlikeable or unsavoury.. we'll never know and thats what makes fencing on the forum such fun